To have or not to have ... (continue #4)

a doctrinal statement.

The last two comments on this discussion:

4/22/06

Perhaps many are not aware of the reason this talk even began. Steve Atkerson who as you know was here not very long ago. Larry asked Steve in an email if he would put a link to our site on his site.

Steve replied something to the effect that he was reluctant becuase we do not state what we believe and he was worried about sending people to a site where bad teaching may result.

It was then pondered, do the valley house churches hold to a basic orthodox beleif. Some things are ok to be in question about, but others are not.

For example, I think the Trinity is an essential teaching. It is the foundation of the understanding of God and how he works with us humans. The Father decides to send the Son who is empowered by the Holy Spirit, and so on. On a side note it is very interesting how many three part sayings about God there are in the NT. That would be a neat study by itself.

Sooner or later there will a church teaching something that we have problems with, it has happened through out history and we are going to have to deal with it. If this statement of faith is not the answer then what is? Our elders need to be on the alert as the scripture says, for false teachers and expose them so the poeple are not hurt by them. The word teaches us this.

One of the problems I think we are going to be dealing and already is this postmodernism thing, I see it creeping in all over the place and it saddens me becuase quite frankly it is bad teaching. But if we are so afraid to offend or be devisive or what ever, then this kind of thing will run rampit and consume our young.

So, one answer is that our elders be in study and prayer so they would be able to recognize bad teaching and correct it as it comes up in their own churches. It may also be a good idea to share teachers, if you are gifted why keep it to your group aske them to send you to us and others. Or perhaps we can come teach your group, I would love to share hospitial ministry teachings.

The other thing we need to do is be sure that we and our understand what we believe and what is essential and what is not.

Jesus is LORD that is essential, one God one Savior to the world. Essential

The rapture not essential.

Hope this makes sense.

(Henry Staggs)
----

4/24/06
Brothers and Sisters,

To finalize this discussion as it relates to the Phoenix Area House Church website, I want to make a couple of points.

There have been so many good points made during this discussion and I thank everyone who contributed. And to those that didn't think their thoughts were worth a hearing, shame on you, you should have said something. I'm sure there will be other opportunities.

Point one. Going back to Ralph's emails where he tried so hard to point out the mission and goals of the website.

The mission of the Phoenix Area House Churches is to network Phoenix and Central Arizona house churches with one another for the purposes of mutual encouragement, service, and outreach.

Through repentance, loving our neighbors, and making disciples, our goal is to see organic networks of churches throughout the Phoenix and the State of Arizona.

I should know what it says, I put it on the website. Ralph is right. It was never my intent to be the keeper of the "orthodox doctrinal statement" or "statement of faith" for this great movement of God in Phoenix. I don't think God wants anyone to spend their Kingdom time doing that. I don't think God needs anyone to do that either.

As stated below by Henry, the idea only came up after our discussions with Steve on putting a link to our website on theirs. They are very careful that they know the doctrinal stand of any group that they recommend by the nature of providing a website link. I can respect their reasoning because that reflects the NTRF website. It is filled with writings that explain their doctrinal positions. The Phoenix Area House Church website is not like that. It is not the mission of the website. The website represents the connecting of house/organic/simple churches and networks moving toward the mission stated above; to mutually encourage, to serve, and to reach our neighbors for the Kingdom and therefore to see organic networks of house churches all over Phoenix and Arizona. Its as simple as that. The only thing close to doctrine are the mentions of house church practices. And even those are probably not consistent with all the house churches listed.

Point two. Henry has a good point in that there are many churches that do not hold to some of the most basic of historical orthodox Christian beliefs. What do we do to distinguish ourselves from groups like that? Will non-Christians seeing the website think that we are probably just another kooky group waiting for the spaceship to pick us up? I wouldn't be surprised if some people think that way toward any group of Christians who are able to fellowship in love and faith. When that happens, I hope any one of us will be able to explain the truth about the house churches in Phoenix. And then be prepared to take it to the next level. With the logical conclusion being a new life in Christ and a new church in Phoenix.

As Ed indicated, historically, groups that hold a radically different doctrine are not generally interested in fellowshipping with groups that don't hold to their same beliefs. Generally groups like that need the institutional "covering" to stay the way they are. But that doesn't mean we should drop our guard. Every fellowship needs to be on guard against such things. The best way to do this is to have your own statement of faith. Thats the way we distinguish ourselves from those other groups mentioned above. I encourage each house church to formulate their own.

But don't send it to me unless you want me to put it on a web page for your specific church. I have no other reason to know what it is. And oh yes, I forgot to mention. There is no membership requirements or dues to pay to be included in the Phoenix Area House Churches website. The only thing I ask is that anyone listed be willing to communicate, fellowship, and partner with the other groups. If that happens, the Kingdom of God will grow, the unsaved will be reached, the saints will be edified, and God will be glorified. Amen!

I hope I have clarified the purpose of the web site. I do invite churches that do not currently have their own web sites to send the text to me and I will create a very basic informational page linked off the map.
(Larry)